Salon Retail Excellence with Arif Isikgun

As salon business owners, we have a love-hate relationship with our retail brands and retail opportunities. Here to help us today is founder of AI Business Consultancy, Arif Ishikgan, who is a retail expert and beauty educator. He's a speaker and an award-winning strategic thinker too. His innovative approach has transformed results for brands, spas, and salons around the world, helping them achieve record sales and maximise their team's potential. Let's get him on the show, shall we? Arif, welcome to the Build Your Salon podcast. Hi, Phil, and thank you so much. What a lovely introduction was that. I mean, when I heard it, I was like, oh, I think my head's just grown two sizes. You did a beautiful job of writing it, darling. I did indeed, absolutely. Self-gratification, what can I say? No, it's lovely to be here. Thank you so much for having me. You're very welcome. And I'm very excited to have somebody on talking about retail. So I said in the intro that we have a love-hate relationship with retail. And I think there's lots of people that retail in salons and clinics everywhere, but only because we kind of feel like we ought to. And so I'm really keen to get somebody on the show who really has a passion for retailing and who thinks that it can add something to our business in a very meaningful way. So I guess my first question, we'll start with some thorny ones, shall we? Why should salons and clinics be retailing at all? I think retail is fundamental. You know, whenever I talk about retail, there is this sigh. People will just give a monotonous tone. They're like, oh, retail is so boring. But actually, retail is a lot of fun. You know, I've been in the beauty industry for a very long time and I started on the shop floor. And I remember the power of storytelling and how you engage people. And retail allows you to deep dive into ingredients, into really powerful stories, to personify products, to create them almost like a lifestyle choice. So that's really important. I think it's also really important to understand that retail is an avenue of self-expression, believe it or not. Retail allows you to build relationships, to create meaningful conversations within your environments and on the floor primarily. But actually, financially, retail is a safe bet. So just if I can share a figure with you, if you have a clinic or a salon and you are open seven days a week, perhaps you have a team of five and each one of your team members sells one product at £50 per day.

Do the math. At the end of the year, that's an increase in turnover of £83,000. It's the easiest way. It's the most cost effective solution to increase revenue within your business for very little expense because it should be tangible and a part of people's job day to day. Okay. Okay. So you've convinced me from a business point of view. So you found my soft spot. When we start talking about profit and numbers, that's when I get excited because ultimately that's why we're all in business anyway. I think the bit that I particularly get excited about with retail is that there's a limit on almost every aspect of our business. There are only so many clients you can see in a day, which puts a ceiling on your earnings. Even if you're charging very top end prices for your services, there is only so far you can go. Whereas as soon as we put retail into the equation, there's no limit anymore. We can, you know, it doesn't take any extra time to retail to 10 clients a day, 20 clients a day, or people that are outside the business too. So I think that's where I get excited about retail. But do you think it's a valid strategy to not retail? That's a really interesting, interesting point. I think you're right. You create a glass ceiling. So as long as your business model has been built around not retailing, then of course it's working for you. It's not for everyone. But in my experience, you get better longevity, you get better aftercare with your clients. So if I was to give you an example again, you know, if you were to go for a treatment and treatments are fantastic. They give incredible results, but they only last for a period of time. So say, for instance, you have an innovative facial or you had some red light therapy or some KC treatment. Within about one to two, three days, you start noticing those effects dissipate and disappear within one to two weeks. It's all gone. But actually, if you were to boost that with product and have aftercare, which is on a far better level, day by day, as your clients are using their aftercare, they will see an improvement in their skin texture, their tone, their radiance, you know, all that good stuff that we want to have. And they will make that connection between you, your business and that transformation for them. So I think it's actually really vital. It also allows you to be prescriptive and to put people on a course of action. And it also creates more meaningful areas of conversation to build relationships with your clients.

I love that. So we've got those client benefits. They're getting enhanced results. We're reinforcing that relationship with the client, too. And there's a business benefit, too. OK, so we're retailing. Yeah. Where do you think we've been going wrong? Because even in, you know, I'm very lucky and I get to see behind the curtain in lots and lots of businesses. And there are a lot of people that are struggling even to get to, you know, eight, nine, ten percent of turnover as far as retail is concerned. And given that they've been trying for years and years and years, you can see why salon and clinic owners get a bit disheartened and a bit disillusioned by retail. Where are they going wrong, do you think? We think retail is retail. And it's not. Retail is a conversation over two people over a cup of tea. Retail is sharing stories and adding value. If you truly believe that a product is going to work for your client, then you tell them because that is the expectation that you should have as a professional. So first of all, it's how we frame retail is the first problem. I think retailing should be done immediately in the first 30 seconds to five minutes of the consultational process. We always leave it towards the end where then there's this awkward pause. So it's like, so I've used this and this on you today. And it's been really lovely. It's got vitamin A and it's going to do A, B and C. And do you want to take that with you, say, but you don't have to take it with you. So I'll write it down for you or I'll give you a sample and we can have a think about it. Okay. And we put ourselves in that situation where we create those fundamentals, where we've created the barrier and the block. We're actually, as experts within that area, we should be able to say, right, if you want to be on this journey, on this transformation with me, you need to start using A, B and C and D. I want you to start using this tonight and I'll book you back in in three weeks time. It's as simple as that. We have to look at sales and service as retail as a part of treatment and treatment as a part of retail. The two go hand in hand. You can't have great skin without great aftercare, regardless of what treatments you're having.

Yes, I know that, you know, treatments enhance the overall effect and they're far better than a single product. However, having a customized routine that's systematic will deliver you results over time and that longevity. So that's the first thing. The second thing, which is unspoken, is actually the mentality of our therapists or our clinic in our clinics or the people who are working on the ground. There is a huge fear of rejection, huge fear. And especially in the younger generation where we don't like putting ourselves in a position where people will tell us no. It knocks our confidence. We scale back in our expertise and we feel like perhaps we haven't got the ability within ourselves. So I think it's two ways. We have to shift how we think about retail and sales. We need to think of it as an element of service and it's obligatory. And then we have to think about, actually, let's go over this fear of rejection. People are quite right. They're happy to say no to us. However, if we create the environment and we create the building blocks for them to believe, have loyalty, trust is a huge one and be emotionally connected to us, then the likelihood is they're going to purchase. So I really like one of the small points that you kind of skimmed over, but I think is really, really powerful in bringing that retail conversation much earlier into the journey. And that's something that I've been talking about for a long time and making it part of that consultation. And do you find that kind of gets rid of the ick a little bit by bringing it forward rather than that? You can almost see people's body language change when they start talking about retail at the end. They kind of go from being your hair's best friend or your skin's best friend into being this kind of QVC presenter where they're suddenly holding up products and talking about features and benefits. So what else could we be doing to get past that discomfort, do you think? Yeah, we need to be more direct in our approach and use our expertise to really make our clients understand that this is what they need. So for hair, for example, you know, there's nothing wrong with saying you've come here today for this hairstyle or this type you've been using. You tell me you're using these products for you to continue to get this hairstyle that you want. You need to be using this because what you're using currently isn't as effective for you. It's good, but it's not giving the results that you want. So you need to take this with you. And as being as direct as that, this could only happen if you built that rapport and that relationship. And that's why it's super, super important to think about that conversational style, which is something that I teach and I'm very, very passionate about. But equally, throughout the consultation, throughout the service or the treatment, whatever it is you're doing, if it's a salon clinic or spa environment doesn't matter.

There are certain touch points where you can build retail back into conversation. And it's just like marketing, isn't it? You know, if you if you if someone sees you, first of all, it's probably unlikely to buy the first time or a product. The more touch points they have in that focus, the more likelihood they are to purchase. It's exactly the same with conversation that we have. We need to build retail in. And so that's one way. And equally building in that conversational style, sharing what you love, your vulnerability, your passions is always an incredible example, because it really helps to elevate you as an not just professional, but an individual almost as a friend or a therapist, because a lot of people come to us at those times of needs. It's quite cathartic when they just unload their day or their week or what they've been going through. So building those relationships is very important. But but making sure that we are going back into retail and creating those touch points as equally as important. So how do you begin? You know, obviously, you've been working with a huge range of different brands and spas and salons and clinics. So where do you start? Because I think a big problem in particularly in the salon businesses that I've had had dealings with, they're just they're in a kind of corporation habits of not retailing. So where do you even begin to change that? I think the first step is being comfortable with talking about product. And whether or not you sell or you don't sell, whether you feel you're doing it right or not right, you must introduce a product or a few products to every single client until it becomes repetitive and habitual, until you feel very confident in doing it. You know, like I train and I create these tools for people, but if they don't utilize their vocabulary or they don't utilize language and talk about it, it's not going to happen. So first of all, we have to become very comfortable with talking about products. And that has to become a habit. It needs to be consistent, no exceptions. Even if someone is using everything, they don't need anything. We can still advise them on other products that may help or could be implemented in their routine a little bit later on. And just to build on that a little bit, we've done a previous episode, I think, on promises that we make our customers. And it was a promise in my salon that we would tell you about every product we're using on your hair today, or you take them all home for nothing.

And it was a really overnight. It was just a tool to get people having those conversations. Yeah, we needed to look at how they were talking about those products eventually. And we needed to make sure it wasn't just rattling off a list of products really quickly to put a tick in a box, but just to get into the habit of talking about stuff. That customer promise was at the bottom of every mirror, every styling section, so that the customer knew that conversation was going to happen. The stylist knew that conversation had to happen as well. And it did break our habit very, very quickly. So you mentioned customer journey. First of all, what does customer journey mean to you? And then I guess the second question would be, where does retail fit into that journey? Yeah, so customer journey is quite a big thing to unpick, isn't it? Customer journey can be really anything. But primarily within this context, the customer journey is how the customer feels, how they're interacted with from the second they walk in to the second they walk out, and equally the aftercare, whether that's phoning up, making sure they're okay, booking back in, how we deal with those clients, that expectation. I think customer journey should be very much conversational, luxury, but also very friendly. I mean, when we think about it, and a prime example is BA, British Airways versus other budget airlines, and then you've got Virgin. And I was actually at, I was speaking at a conference, and one of the keynote speakers before me was actually talking about how she actually used to work for Virgin in terms of customer experience. And then she went on to work for the London 2012 Olympics and was in charge of the team of people who were volunteers. There was like 24,000 of them, mental. And it was about how do we keep them engaged and keep that journey because they're working for free. It was super, super interesting. What she said was, be the Virgin, as in give exceptional level of service, but be conversational and friendly. Go above and beyond, but be cheeky and funny. And that's what I look for. I've worked in the Harrods and Selfridges. And I think, you know, when I won consultant of the year or I won 100% on the mystery shops, I was still myself. I still gave my personality. I still had fun because it was a joy to be there and sharing stories was a passion of mine. And, you know, I dealt with royalty. I had celebrities. It was wonderful. But I never stopped being me and I never stopped having that moment where I could be happy and cheeky and be directional and be direct.

I think sometimes we feel that luxury should be kind of cold or it might be a bit too conservative, but I don't think it is. I think luxury is understanding going above and beyond and making your client feel that they are so important. And if that means saying, Mrs. Smith, we're on this journey of transformation with your hair or with your skin. And in order to do that, I want to give you the best results. You need to be using these products. Then that's what we do. It doesn't come across as, you know, dictating. It doesn't come across as perhaps I'm being too pushy. I'm doing it for her interest or for her to get those best results. So I feel that there is a balance there, but never lose your personality. And sometimes, and I'm guessing, Phil, you're the same. When I do mystery shops, I go to different clinics or salons or spas or whatever it is, they're aloof or they're cold. The service is amazing. Don't get me wrong. The service is amazing, but there's no, there's no soul behind it. You know, and I think it's so important to show who you are and your personality and that builds loyalty. I used to go to a lot more salons than I do now. So when I, with my one-to-one coaching, I used to go and see all of my clients. And now that's just not possible for me. Um, it's not, not viable as part of the business model. Um, and in whatever town I was in, I would very often go for a haircut or a treatment. Um, and I always made it a rule because I was going to see these people quite frequently. I always made it a rule that if they offered me a rebook, I would take it. And if they recommended a product, I would take it. Um, and hand on my heart in five or six years of traveling around the country, I have never bought a retail product because that conversation had never happened. And these weren't spit and sawdust salons. You know, I am rather a precious princess, particularly with my hair. Um, and I was always completely baffled that people could afford to run their businesses that way. And, and I think that's where one of my first questions was, is it a valid strategy to not retail at all? And I, and in my own coaching, I kind of think it is a valid strategy because I would rather you didn't retail than pretend you're going to retail. I'd rather you, you didn't retail at all than have stuff on the shelf and then not even give people the opportunity to buy it.

And it's always been kind of baffling to me. Um, so the, the other thing I wanted to add though, is, um, customer journey. What I'm trying to encourage people to do now is start that journey much, much sooner. Um, it doesn't just have to be a quick text message reminder of your appointment. We could be seeing that as a touch point and, and even start retailing add ons and all the rest of it. We could start that journey much, much earlier before the customer even comes through the door. So, um, when we're talking to people about retail, one of the excuses that gets thrown at me a lot is, well, people can just buy this stuff online. Um, so how, how do we compete with that? How can we compete when we've got some quite big names that can undercut us, um, and deliver stuff next day as well? Yeah. Um, that's a really interesting question and it does come up repeatedly. And I think depending on the business and the model that you have, there are other tactics that you can have, you know, you can price compare and you, you know, and you can, you can do that kind of tactic. However, from the education point of view, you have to create want. And what I mean by that is people need to be really excited to get that product home immediately and start using it. Mm-hmm . So have you ever had that thing where something has launched and you really want to try it and you, but you can get it for next day delivery, but you're just like, I'm just gonna go to the shops and buy it. Cause I want it right now. Um, and that's creating want. And actually you can do that through storytelling and a piece of work that I'm doing with at the moment is with Cal brand. So Cal is global. They have Keris silk or Bay gold, but I'm sure you know them very well. Um, and I'm working with a global training team, um, to create that one, to create storytelling and to make people visualize using that product, but also being grossed in that power of that story. You know, stories are so powerful with, with, with, as the human race, we have. Spoken about them. We've shared them for time immemorial and they were how we actually built communication and how we started building language was through sharing stories or. You know, even for the Neanderthal days building language, it's so intrinsic to who we are. Great advertising campaigns, our stories, things that you connect with our stories. You probably connect more with a brand story than a product. You know, when you always say sell the brand, the product will sell itself. And actually those connecting markers, we need to build into our training.

We need to really make people understand the value of that retail piece, but also. So they can appreciate the story behind it and be intrinsically captivated, romanticized and feel amazed. And brands do that. They do that a lot. However, definitely they've taken their, their foot off the pedal. I think brands can definitely invest more in educating people on the floor, that retail piece. But equally, if you have your own business to keep your team riled up, to keep them fiery, engaged, passionate is all through the education, the storytelling piece. I love that. And that's how we create that one. Yeah, I love that. And I love the idea that you're bringing some storytelling into, into some of those big brands. And I do know quite a bit about cow actually, because we're a Goldwell salon and we've been dealing with Goldwell for quite some time. And interestingly, I see it with some of their brands and not others. So I always thought they do a really good job with storytelling in something like Malt and Brown. But when you look at Goldwell and KMS and it all kind of disappears and turns into this technical jargon and it's all very ingredients based and a little bit of benefit in there and all that storytelling kind of disappears. And we do need that from our manufacturers. We need something that we can buy into and get behind. And while you were talking about we buy the brand first straight away, my mind went to not a cow brand, it's an Estee Lauder brand, but Joe Malone. We just, you know, all of a sudden there's colognes out. I knew I was going to buy one of those before I'd even, before I'd even smelt them, because I just love the brand, even though Joe's not even part of it anymore. I think it's really interesting how we kind of buy into these stories in a really meaningful way. So as far as competing is concerned, though, you know, I've heard stories of people checking prices while they're sat in the chair waiting for colours to process and seeing whether they can get stuff online. So that creating the want, is that purely about the energy that you're putting behind retail? Is it purely about creating that excitement, do you think? Or is there something else we could be doing? Yeah, I think it is. I think it very much is. It's down to the user and, you know, the person who is in charge of that client at that time to create that. It's very difficult without going to the technicalities of what else we can be doing, but we could be offering them money off treatments. You could, you know, you could do price comparison and perhaps offer money off treatments next time when they rebook, you'll, you know, you'll reimburse the difference for them to make sure they're taking products.

And the thing is, yes, at first it's a small loss, but it's a long time gain. Because every time they come in for a haircut, every time they come for a facial treatment, every time they come for aesthetics, doesn't matter what it is, they will then repurchase. So we have to look at the bigger picture. We need to convert those clients from just coming in and seeing it as, or I'm just going to get my treatment today, to coming in and saying, oh no, this is my full experience. I need my new products. I need this. Is there anything else you can recommend for me? That's what we want to happen. And that comes with building that one-on-one relationship, because actually the value that is added by having a professional there, overseeing your hair, your face, your body, it doesn't matter. Giving you advice, giving you those recommendations and being on this journey with you is massively, massively more important to our clients than saving two or three pounds. And I think, or it could be 10 or 15 pounds, it doesn't matter what it is. That value is so important. And we need to think of that value add that we're giving. So again, it's that mindset change. So retail is a tactic to add value to your client journey, to your client experience, but equally to create longevity in your business and create loyalty moving forward. I think the only thing I want to add to that is if you've got, if you've got a service that, you know, there are some services where if people don't take proper care afterwards, things can go really wrong. And I'm talking about, you know, some of the higher end transformational facial stuff, particularly around, you know, aftercare on peels and things like that is front of mind for me at the moment, for some reason. But also in the hair space, when we're talking about color correction, you know, you go home, use the wrong shampoos, things are going to unravel really quickly. So what I quite often teach is just price it in. If you know that's essential for a great longer term result, just price it in and don't give them the choice because you know they're going to need those products. And I think you're kind of doing a disservice if they don't take them. No, I agree with you. So how can people work with you? What do you do? What does that look like? Yeah, that's a cool question. When I started this off, you know, I was just doing trainings. I launched my own consultancy about six years ago after working kind of globally with corporates and decided that the corporate way wasn't where I wanted to go. I wanted to be a champion of storytelling because I love it. I remember I was 21 years old. I was in a Guerlain, not 20. I was in a Guerlain training and Richard Hawkins, the founder, well, no, sorry, the director of education for Guerlain in the UK was telling me the story of Shalimar.

1925, first Oriental fragrance ever. Most Orientals to this day lay homage to that fragrance. And he took me on the journey to India and the story of the Rajah Mahatmahan, his third wife, and that he wanted a son to secure the throne for him. He had lots of daughters and two wives, but his favourite wife, his third wife, bore him a son finally, but she died in childbirth. And he was stricken with grief, absolutely bewildered. So he erected the Taj Mahat in the Shalimar gardens where they used to walk under the moonlight with the jasmine and the rose bushes. And to this day, Shalimar is an ode to love. And those ingredients in the Shalimar gardens are in the perfume. And you don't, you know, that's just a snippet of the story. You haven't even smelt the fragrance. So you might know Shalimar. I love Shalimar. That nod to love, that human connection of undying love that we have. And it just connects you. Stories are vital. So I wanted to do that in a way to really encompass that energy and those levels with new brands. So I work with brands all around the world in terms of branded. I come on board as fractional head of global education. I have clients all across the world, which is amazing. I get to write all their training material, all their global strategy. And I was asked about two years ago by Amman Hotel Group to launch their fine fragrance collection into their locations all around the world. And it was going into spa. And I didn't, I have worked with spa before, but not primarily. And I devised a strategy. It was very successful. And I started to notice that we're not selling in spa salon or clinic retail. So I've used the 16 years of my experience. And now I'm working one-on-one with certain spa salons and clinics across the country. And I've launched the retail excellence and sales empowerment course, which has taken me about a year and a half to write. It's a six-month program with three modules. And I put it through very vigorous beta testing because I wanted to ensure that what I was delivering was of excellence. And it really transformed people's retail. Because there are, I've heard horror stories before of retail trainers coming in, doing sessions. And yeah, we have a spike for a week or two, but nothing has lasting change. I've even put myself on a mental health course and a teaching qualification to ensure that I'm really changing mindsets and having those nuances to really change and focus.

I launched the beta testing across five different spas and salons, award-winning in the UK. And after six months, the increase was a minimum of 120% retail. Amazing. Thank you. It's the first retail course to be Javier endorsed. So I'm sure you know Javier. When that endorsement is a lot of work, I'm not going to lie. But when they signed it on this, you know, when I got that badge and that certificate, I was so, so happy. It's 30 hours to pull CPD credits as well, which is incredible. So if anyone's doing any other qualifications, because there's a lot of kind of home learning, independent learning, as I call it in the course. So yeah, I'm running this out across the UK and it's had incredible results. I can only take a handful of businesses on at a time. I just had an amazing write-up by Spa Business European magazine, which is amazing. So maybe in professional beauty as well, watch this space. So yeah, if people want that help, it is available. And the whole idea is that it is lasting change. We look at three modules. The first one is storytelling, the power of conversation. How do we build the power of conversation? How do we tell meaningful stories? The second is how do we connect that to our customer and that customer journey, that engagement, and use retail tactics such as reconfirmation and things like that. And the third is kind of underpinning that with the classical retail sales. So it's done over six months. It's looked at modularly. There is a lot of focus on growth and development. It's a lot of focus on ensuring that we're hitting target or we're seeing an increasing conversion rate. There's a lot of accountability to it. It's not easy. But after six months, you get the accreditation with a full certification as well and an increase in your business revenue, which is fantastic. That sounds amazing. And I haven't been through the program, but I already know that it's just going to be superb. And I do wish you the very best of luck with it. Who would you say it's perfect for? If you have a team of over three people, I would say it's perfect for that. If you find that you're struggling with retail, if you're finding that you've got high ticket pricing for particular treatments, then I think it's absolutely perfect for you. I've worked it with a team of three. I've also worked it with a team of 26.

So it really is few and far between. In January, I will be launching a cohort for independents because it's been asked for. So it's for spas, salons and clinics. If you're in hair care, if you're in professional facials or massage, anything where you can retail a product, regardless of what it is, then it's for you. Fantastic. And this episode is actually scheduled to go out at the beginning of January. So perfect timing to take retail seriously and jump in there with what's going to be an incredible program, I just know. So before you leave us, I always have three questions that I ask people at the end of every guest episode. And I never warn people, though I do think some people have listened now. They know what the questions are. I might have to change them up in the future. What's the best piece of advice that you've ever personally been given? What's the best piece of advice? Okay. Reframe every aspect of your life. If you think it's negative, always look for the positive. I've worked a lot on my mental health the last couple of years. Terrible imposter syndrome. You know, even winning awards and traveling around the world, still don't feel I'm nearly enough. And I think that vulnerability is important to share. Look at it and reframe. You are enough. What you're doing is good, but there's always chances for you to succeed. And look at every opportunity as an opportunity. Don't look at it as a negative. And if you were mentoring someone right at the beginning of their journey and they were inspired by your journey and wanted to follow in your footsteps, where would you tell them to start? Really take a hard look at what you love. What is your passion? I would say, you know, you've heard the, I hope I get this expression right, jack of all trades, but master of none. I would say focus your talents. When I first started out, my industry turned their back on me. They said, you couldn't, you couldn't do this with an education. There are other consultancies that offer education as a side project. And I was like, no, no, I want this to be full. I want brands to understand the concept that education is, can revitalize the entire industry. We just have to look at it from a different lens. And it took me a lot of time to figure that out. A lot of people said, do this as well. Do this on the side. I'm like, no, no, no, I need to be. And when you find your passion and your laser focus, then you can diversify. But I think become a master of your craft. And finally, what is the best thing about working with salons and clinics?

The people. We are in a business of emotional transformation. We think people come in to look better, but it's not. They come in to feel better, regardless of the haircut, regardless of skin, facial, doesn't matter what it is. And being with people on that journey, sharing those experiences and learning. I learn every day from my peers, from people I come in contact with. And just being in the beauty industry. I think it's a great industry to be in. I love it. Superb. And if people want to keep in touch with you, what's the best way for them to do so? I'm building my Instagram. I'm not technological at all. AI Beauty is my initials. It doesn't stand for AI. Everyone thinks I'm like some kind of guru when it comes to compute. So I could barely write an email. I could do a little bit more than that. But yeah, contact me. Jump on the AI Beauty Consultancy Instagram. You've got the link tree there. Sign up to a newsletter or email me. I love to hear from people. Or hello at AIBeauty.co.uk or Arif at AIBeauty.co.uk. Arif, thank you so much for your time today. It's been an absolute pleasure talking to you. And I'm sure we're going to have you back on the podcast again very soon, if that's okay. Absolutely, Phil. It's been a pleasure also. Lovely speaking with you. And I love your passion. Honestly, it's phenomenal. Thank you so much. Thank you. So there we have it. Goodness knows if you don't feel inspired by retail now, it's never going to happen for you. Please reach out to Arif and get the details of his program. It's going to be absolutely phenomenal. And I hope a game changer for so many of you salon and clinic owners. Would you like to be a guest on a future episode of the Build Your Salon podcast? If so, my email address is at the bottom of the screen. Phil at buildyoursalon.com. You know I love hearing from my salon owner friends. Anyway, just seven short days until I'm coming in your eyes and ears again with another dose of my wise hour wisdom. And until then, take care.